City Council Discussed Stop Signs on City Square
July 17th, 2010 by Joe BurgessAt Thursday night’s meeting, city council member Tim Chase expressed his ongoing concern about the “all-way stop signs” that have been placed on the city square.
Chase accused Mayor Joe Rogers of telling or recommending the Arkansas Highway & Transportation Dept. that the city preferred stop signs, instead of stop lights, when the study to determine that issue was requested. Chase added that he didn’t recall the city council having discussed the issue.
Chase also suggested that the city council, at a later date, consider passing a resolution expressing their desire to have lights put up at the 2 locations, instead of the current stop signs.
A “blind spot” on the north side of the square was also mentioned.
The next topic, related to the signs/lights, was if the man who caused the damage with a November truck wreck had insurance coverage. Mayor Rogers reported that there was “around $22,000″ (Damage to businesses and other utilities probably filed claims against the vehicle’s insurance, as well.)
Council member, Judge Clifton Bond told the council that he felt they should get a letter or petition to the AHTD, requeting that the lights be replaced., in hopes that this effort may get their attention.,
Bond reporeted that he understood that replacement cost for the lights would be around $80,000, and that he felt that cost was the reason that stop signs had been put up on place of the stop lights.
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Posted June 26, 2010
Hour Long Video of Traffic Patterns at Monticello Square – 755 Vehicles
MonticelloLive on Vimeo.
With all of the recent comments and discussion about the traffic at the Monticello square, the best way to analyze traffic patterns seemed to be a video recording of passing traffic (since most folks are usually only there for a minute at a time).
This video was recorded Wednesday afternoon, starting around 2:30, and runs for just over an hour.
There were approximately 755 vehicles that went through the southeast corner of the intersection, averaging around 100 vehicles every 8 minutes.
Although most drivers came to a complete stop, the most amazing thing that I noticed was the largest vehicle that came through the intersection did not stop. Also two cars drove straight out of the “right turn only” lane, which could’ve caused them to collide with a vehicle that may have been driving in the correct lane.
Although no one was seen driving the wrong way on a one-way street, that still happens approximately once each week.
Although, this is the most boring video that MonticelloLive has ever posted, it does give an accurate representation of traffic patterns around the Monticello square.
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Posted June 21, 2010
New “All-Way” Stop Signs Being Installed on the Square by AHTD, to Replace Old Traffic Signals
New “All-Way” Stop Signs Being Installed on the Square by AHTD, to Replace Old Traffic Signals
Arkansas Highway and Transportation Dept. employees were working on the Monticello square Monday morning installing the new “all-way” stop signs, that will be taking the place of the old stop signals that were damaged in a traffic accident, just before Thanksgiving, when a pick-up truck driver fell asleep, and did major damage to several store fronts on East Gaines St, the stop-light, and knocked over a power pole.
There has been an ongoing disagreement as to whether stop signs should be used to replace the out-of-date stoplights, which seems to have been settled by a study by the AHTD, according to Alderman Claudia Hartness, who told a group meeting at the Chamber of Commerce, last week, of the outcome of the study.
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too bad this isnt facebook,oh wait,facebook doesn’t have a *dislike* button.
Hate that!!
I liked the red lights much better!! It’s almost impossible to get on mccloy from the the Union bank employee parking & the bank!!
I have hated the stop signs since they were put up!! I see someone run tone of them every single time i have to go that way. The stops signs make me not even want to go to the square!!
i sure hope they at least take down the tacky trash bag covered lights!!
They need to keep people from parking in the last 2 parking places by discount merchandise so peoplt can actually get to the stops signs!
I think the employees should not be allowed to park in front of their own store but that is a whole new topic i could go on about.
With the stop signs up it makes downtown look kinda Mayberrish.
The new Mayor said in his speech during the last debate that he would have new red lights installed. http://www.monticellolive.com/mondays-mayors-forum-videos/
Wonder if he will follow through on his promise now that stop signs have been installed?
Makes a town feel smaller when they take stop lights away.
thats the cheap way for city not to replace lights.i hope they remember it when someone gets killed there.its hardly a day goes by there’s not a close call there.i was in ins office on square and they said its real bad there now and a matter of time.
I hope the new Mayor addresses this issue first. Its hard to get out of any of the shops along Gaines St.It is ridiculous. Who do we all complain to?
I liked the lights much better too!
I want the traffic lights back! Signs just do not work on the Square.
Monticello has really gone backwards. I hope it will not hurt business on the square but I know I try to stay away from the square as much as possible. I hate the stop signs. Seems unfair that one person makes all this mess and the rest of Monticello has to pay for it, also. I agree with the other person about the plastic bags, they really look tacky.
I own a business and I think people that the owners have a right to park where they want to.
But I agree the stop signs are bull And it’s sad that we live in a town with such cheapskates that won’t fix the lights on their own town square.
I don’t like them either, going backwards instead of keeping up with the times.
Very Much Dislike.
We are worried about how stop signs look..when there is a collapsed building on the square. Thats a issue. Anyways the stop lights where nheld by a rope.. YEP THAT LOOKS GOOD.. How many town squares have been to that they had stoplights??..Not many.. The stop lights where an issue to begin with. You couldn’t see if it was green..yellow..or red..the sun always blocked it. You had to squat down in your car to look at it.. Thats an issue..and to you people saying we going backwards..think about this how old is stoplight on a rope…another issue i see is the crosswalks..what about them..when is it safe to go..Nobody knows..But with that light on a rope we knew when to cross…without we are like cows on astroturf..I’m just keepin it real
You have to squat down in your car at other red lights in town too? Should you put “all ways” up there too i.e. main redlight by rays. Sometimes you can’t see it either? So do you think we need stops signs thre too!!
James you may feel that way about parking but is hard to get to the stop sign because there are cars parked on top of the corner.
Mr. Keepin it Real, totally agree with the collapsed building that is ridiculous!! it makes the squaure look like trash!!! It embrassed me when we had Channel 7 down here a month ago. What about this restore downtown thing we “get” to be a aprt of, we should have gotten the square restoring prject instead. although our downtown looks likes trash also!
I think whoever needs to be cleaning up the collapsed building that occurred in October needs to be done asap. in could cause a serious injury if it were to fall on a passing by car! I would be ticked!!
I sure hope our new mayor will remove the stupid stop signs and put of the red lights again.
UAM Grad i would say the city but apparently they dont care or our mayor would have put the red lights back up!!
Does the city own the square or does the hwy dept on the square? City workers are the ones that maintained the lights, but the hwy dept are the one that put the stop signs up. Also, why shouldn’t someone be going after the person that fell asleep and damaged them? A lady ran over a pole on the square,nightlight pole, and from what I heard, our soon to be old Mayor,thank goodness, was on the phone everyday going after that lady to get that pole fixed and It got fixed..point is, seems like since Mayor Rogers should be on the phone getting the person that messed our lights up fixed..And yes, our Future Mayor Maxwell did say he would repair the lights, but can he if the hwy dept owns the roads going fhrew the square?
As far as I know it’s the cities decision to do what it wants if this many people want the lights back up we must contact our city council it’s all well and good that the new mayor said he’s going to put the lights back up but guess what??? He has no authority! It’s the council that make the decision so everyone needs to contact them asap!!! Not only does it look horrible it has also almost killed some people b/c people don’t stop! The lights should go back up but y can’t that be better lights that don’t hang from a string?? Maybe all that tax money we pay should go towards something useful and not making buildings pretty and the rich richer! I’m so sick of small town b/s
Glad to know I’m not the only person who prefers the stop lights, thinks the stop signs are stupid, and the trash bags over the lights are tacky!
Right now East gaines from the square to Old carson’s store is just a drag race, one car after another. If you travel east and west thru town you only have to slow down at the signs, so I guess those drivers are okay with this. If, like me, you are trying to turn onto the east/west dragstrip it is nearly impossible. The traffic is never staggered enough to allow anyone to enter. Safely. There will be an accident.
If the new Mayor doesn’t keep his promise and install working lights he needs to do two things: 1) educate Monticello drivers on the proper way to negotiate 4-way or all-way stops. 2) instruct his Police Dept to inforce at least the speed limits so there is some gap in thru traffic and ticket anybody that parks too close to an intersection.
I used to enjoy walking around downtown but no more. It is not even safe for pedestrians to try to cross the street.
At first I couldn’t believe Monticello didn’t have even one spare traffic light. I still don’t know why losing one light forced the deactivation of the other. Goodbye downtown.
the stop signs are MUCH better than the lights.. it makes it so much faster and easier to go through the square.. all the stop lights would do was back up traffic.
Maybe turning into a Main Street Town, some good decisions will be
made. I used to own Family Ties downtown and this response is to
James Henry, I did not park in front of my store and no employees
were allowed to park in front of anyone’s business including mine
because we needed customers to have a parking spot. Without customers, I would not have had a business.
I think that there are other things in the city that need to be of a concern, rather than the stop light. The purpose of anything being there is to STOP and GO, whether it’s a red light or a stop sign. Is it really as big of a deal as everyone makes it out to be? That whole side of town needs a make-over, the stop signs aren’t the problem. Take the money saved from the stop lights and use it for something MORE important! People run stop lights just like they run stop signs. Neither one fixes the problem.
A.R. you must not have to go into bank from front of bank.when backing back out you waited till red light stoped traffic then backed out.now if your in front of bank about the time one car gets pass you so you can back out there’s another coming out thru stop sign to takes it place.there just rabbit stopping and wont wait for someone wanting to get out.and when you do get out and want to go south past court house people coming thru from west of square wont let you cross or inter.
maybe we should send this whole link with comments to the the citty council!! I agree with Desiree!!!
I wouldn’t know the first thing about contacting them though…
But it seems to me Hartness who did the study on putting up the red lights apparently didn’t study the town reactions or opnions to much!!
totally agree with avoid the square… It pretty much is a dragstrip for McCloy & Gaines… and us trying to get out on those streets are just in the way pretty much…. you about get ran over if you turn from ANYWHERE other than a stop sign… Accident waiting to happen!!
I guess I’m in the major minority, but I actually have gotten very used to the stop signs and find it much faster. Traffic doesn’t get backed up as far, and as long as people obey simple traffic laws it isn’t more dangerous. I will say that when it’s “rush hour” for our small town, it can take a while to get around the square.. but thankfully, I’ve found that most other drivers are considerate enough to pause and let others get into the line. If our city does need to save money, and WILL use it for something more worth while, then I personally am all for not purchasing new lights.
I do agree that I find the most dangerous part of driving around the square to be the parking problems. You cannot see what’s coming because people can park so closely to the intersections. I don’t see much of another option, though. Sadly.
All the concerns here is valid . Yes it was easier to get out of the parking when we had the lights , yes it is harder now to enter traffic . On the other hand the traffic moves faster at the square with the signs . The comment about looking like Mayberry , I am sure there are many many residents that remember those times fondly . To think of it as Mayberry sounds good to me , those were simpler happier times and everyone enjoyed the drive through town & took time to notice the beauty in our town . The square does look awful in parts , the building that is falling down is a hazzard on so many levels and it looks alot more TRASHY than the trash bags covering the old lights . The way I see it is ….. no matter if we have lights at the square or stop signs we are never happy . There are going to be complaints either way ….. we are not a happy ppl . Stop lights slowed everyone down and they complained because they were not getting to where they were going fast enough , the stop signs look Mayberryish and tacky but gets us going to where we want to be faster . As for ppl running the stop signs …. I could be going through the square on any given day and someone would run the stop lights , no difference with the stop signs . They even run the lights on 425 which is alot busier than the square . You take your life in your own hands when you drive !! Dont blame it on the stop signs or stop lights it has to do with ppl on the phone, txting, or just not paying attention or even the fact that ppl dont want to slow down long enough to be polite . I was born and raised here in Monticello and I am raising my family here . There is comfort in this town! If we want to worry about something lets worry about what our teens are getting into and focus on something for them , lets worry about stopping the drugs on the streets , the crime rate that makes us scared to go out and go into certains areas of town . The lights at the square seems really a small issue if you ask me !!! Lets concentrate on those issues and look at the bigger picture !!
I have found the Monticello town square much EASIER to travel through and around since the stop signs have been in place. It is quicker, less waiting, shorter lines. Traffic moves at a steady pace. I like the signs. I often shop at Discount Merchandise. I have never had a problem leaving a parking spot with the signs up. I did have problems with the lights because, between the light releasing a long line a traffic from Main street and those vehicles that were merging from around the square, the flow was steady. It was hard to find a gap in which to pull out. I have no problem pulling out now.
The signs also slow the traffic entering the square, especially from McCloy. I use to be really concerned with the speed of traffic when the light was green (those that didn’t have to stop). Now EVERYONE has to slow and stop. I think the signs make it safer.
The “turn only” (right hand) lane at McCloy is the biggest problem I see. Out-of-towners don’t see the turn only signs until it is too late and they drive into the Square beside the people who are in the correct lane. And that was a big problem when the lights were up too. It seems better now to me.
@Desiree: the mayor does have a say so I believe, the mayor, if I am right, mcan veto a bill passed by the city council but it’s hardly ever done
@Hometown girl: well said
also, the building falling in on the square, has a letter been sent to the owner letting them know that they have 30 days to get it cleaned up?..I know someone who has some rental property and one of there tenants front yard was trashy looking and things where everywhere and they, the city,mayor, sent the owner of the property a letter sayn get it clean or you will get fined or we will have it cleaned and send you a bill. My point is the city council made a law for property owners to maintain there properly,has one of these letters been sent to the owner of the building ? Just curious…
I said it earlier and it is being confirmed here: west to east traffic on Gaines is faster and those drivers like the quick stop and go signage. The problem I encounter is trying to enter that very stream of traffic from the north or south side streets.
Take Gaines Street:
Traffic west of the square signs never really clears out long enough to enter because everbody stops, or nearly so, at the signs, backing up cars for blocks …and traffic east of the square never stops long enough to leave any gaps to enter, and then floors it down the slope toward the old RR tracks.
Example: try turning left onto Gaines from Bailey by the Drug store at 4pm. Cars come down Gaines single file at such short intervals there is no safe way to enter. And yet this is still my preferred entry point from the north rather than try to get around our round square. With cars parked from corner to corner along in front of Babetta Barber Shop visibility toward the right is very limited. Of course the store owner right there that parks her black SUV up on the sidewalk right at the corner doesn’t help matters.
Which returns me to my two suggestions to the mayor: enforce speed limits and parking. Please……
With signs the stop and go traffic stops and goes at 1/2 second intervals never leaving a gap for entering traffic. With the lights the ‘stops and goes’ each lasted a minute or so, leaving ample opportunity for others to enter the traffic down stream.
Signal lights have proven themselves nation-wide as a better option than stop signs where there is heavy traffic. They are an improvement; many modern cities and towns have them. They are also, and I repeat myself again, safer for pedestrians.
Those same cities and towns used to have stop signs. If the folks that prefer signs are serious, let’s add an all-way stop sign at the corner of Gaines and every street it intersects with, giving me a chance to turn onto Gaines safely. Then we would have true stop and go–for everybody.
I like the stop signs better. And the person responsible for the damage to the lights is a state employee. Seems ironic, huh?!?
TAKE A DIFFERENT ROUTE! PARK SOMEWHERE ELSE!
at hometown girl- where r u scared to venture out at nite? that’s crazy the reason the teens r getting into trouble is b/c there is absolutely nothing to do here!
I found out today from a council member it is the state highway departments decision weather they go back up and she was in favor of the lights just to clarify, but that the city was going to have to pay for the poles to put the lights back up and the decided not to do it so im sure it will be brought up again if this many people want it done maybe they will listen but u must call ur council members it’s not hard just look up their name and tell them ur concerns!
AGREE WiTH avoid the square 100%!!!
I rarely even go on the square becuase of the traffic!!!
I go around it on gabbert and turn at the railrods on Shelton and then turn left on to main!! Its much easier to go around that way!!
I think there needs to be an All Way by commercial bank insersection to then! Why not one right by Mullis INsurance too!! those are dangerous place also… What about how you can (are suppose to be able to) not have to go to the stop sign when on main street to turn on mccloy or gines when you are already on the squar, you are just suppose to bypass that?? How when teh 1/2 secopnd stop at stop rule is in effect???
Unless there is someone at the stop sign by discount merchandise on main street or it is night time… it is near impossible to get off of main street on to Mccloy unless you use the stop sign!! Same follows when in front of commerical bank trying to get on Gaines!!
The issue of getting out into traffic off of Bailey on to Gaines is not a new issue . Even when the stop lights were there it was still hard to see and hard to get out of . As long as I can remember it has been this way . I have lived here for 40 yrs and theres not one time I can remember that it has been easy . I would rather go back through the square and take my chances . I personally like the stop signs but that is my own personal opinion . No sun in your eyes while trying to figure out if you have to stop or you can go , traffic moves smoother and faster . Try a different route if you want to avoid the square and the stop signs … to make yourself more comfortable …. it may take a min or two longer but if it makes you feel safer then it’s worth it .
Monticello didn’t have enough accidents already….what a cluster F this is gonna be!!!!!!!!!
Interestingly enough I believe the county owns the square or at least is responsible for it. The city can’t even make changes without asking the quorum court and county judge.
they should have left the stoplight up maybe more vehicles would have stopped! a stop sign is just like a freaking yeild sign to most people! Let’s see how many people are in car wreaks now!
i do feel the stop signs at the square are dangerous. most of us who have lived in monticello for a long time are used to the lights. it becomes a habit. i know when i enter the square i still have to remember there’s stop signs there instead of lights and it has been months. if someone has a wreck there, it will end up being a big issue of i told you so and then we will have to make changes. it always takes a major incidence in order for people to see the real danger. just think of albert pike. there has been flooding there before but it took the loss of 20 lives in order for people to start thinking that maybe there should be a flood warning system.
Bring back the redlights. Someone is going to get seriously hurt with just the stop signs there.
Ok I know, I know, I have nothing better to do today than watch this video right? Well it was very informative. 35 minutes in a collision almost happened when someone didn’t stop. By 40 minutes in I counted 3 completely fail to stop at all! 56 minutes in a woman almost got ran over, and another failure to stop at 67 minutes in. Not to mention the countless amount of failure to stops if they were turning right onto main street and 100′s more “California Stops!” Show this video to the hwy department and get those lights back up and hey maybe mention that there needs to b a sign that says right lane right turn only! B/c not everyone on this road is from Monticello and it can b very confusing that’s y the lights r needed. Now Joe u need a video from the other side that’s the one that everyone seems to b running. I would say it’s b/c of the trash bags on the lights people r assuming they don’t have to to stop.
I had understood they were waiting for the insrurance from the truck that put the lights out to pay up, then the lights would be fixed. where is that money… or better yet where did it go?
I also agree with desiree. I didnt watch the whole video but did notice some slow down foot on brake for .2 second stops as welll…
Put the lights back on square I shop at City Drug had to set 15 minutes the other day trying to get out . Someone is going to get killed trying to turn on to Gaines or hurt real bad. I’m for the lights.
IT IS A STATE ROAD///// NOT THE MAYOR…….NOT THE JUDGE………THE STATE!!!!!!
Wow- u r correct it is a state road but here’s the stipulation, The city had to pay for the poles if they wanted the lights to be put up and “The City” decided not to spend the money on that. So it is a kind of “City” thing. I think it all came down to spending to much money on other things.
I see Mayor Chase is flexing his muscle early. Why don’t you people just learn to drvie. Once that I69 corridor opens you won’t need lights anywhere in Monticello. You wonder why SE Arkansas is dying. All you folks b—-ing just need to get $80,000 together and you can have your lights and stop at the lights wondering when the next car might come along instead of stop and go.
I hate the stop signs! I almost get hit every day because someone does not stop when they are supposed to…they just keeping going through the intersection without a second thought! Someone is going to get killed if lights are not replaced.
Hmmm…80,000…Ill do it for 10,000 from scratch. no way it should cost 80,000. Ive seen houses that cost. I am just wondering who is doing it and if they should get taxed for overpay. I dont know much but I can figure maybe 10,000 for the fix tops!
I guess nobody has ever paid any attention to how many cars run the red lights in Monticello. Think about all the accidents we have at the intersections that HAVE red lights. It’s not the stop signs or the red lights it’s the drivers.
Just wondering where all this blame is going. We sound like a bunch of children going back and forth on the firestation, the lights, and then the ring leader(the Mayor) stands up and said ” You Promised”
and I want my way, to heck with what anyone else wants. We are just like the National government, we should have had more people run for the City Council Positions and hold them accountable for the decisions and there should be a limit on what the City Council and the Mayor can decide without a vote from the people. We should have known a perfectly good slab foundation was going to be torn up, when nothing was wrong except the bathrooms. You could have just built the bathrooms outside of that facility just as they are doing anyway with out tearing every park upside down. I know how sports are good for the children. Sports teach the children how to get along, as well as knowing how to win and lose. Sports are wonderful,but just as parents and children and evidently the Mayor can over play that and we are still one sided. What about our education, a library for everyone with computers and older people can be taught to use them to enjoy staying in contact with their children
We’ve got a wonderful life out there with many blessings and lots of new technology for everyone. Our National government is ramming everything down our throat, but we don’t need it here.
We need to control our individual households and take care of our families and that means have control over our spending. Next we need to know what goes on in our local government, how much money is wasted and jumping into things before we know the cost. That property at W. C. Whaley was supposed to have all our police, fire, etc. We should have an asbesto search for $600.00 at the first, not at the tail end, then we would never spent all that money for engineers. We would have just spent the $600.00 and new to raze the building or had it done before we ever bought it. Also just wondering, how does MEDC own things, when the City of Monticello gives the money to them to pay for things. I have never figured that out. Oh Well, enough wondering today. It actually hurts me all over. While you are waiting for your turn on the square, take a look around at the square and see the two feet high weeds especially again the white Pillars of the Union Bank and all the trash on the streets, especially at the grates. I have never seen this before except with this administration. When people return to Monticello, they are astonished the way we look. Instead of picking up trash on the highway, maybe some group would sponsor a cleanup around our once beautiful square.